100 Greastest Nominee Day 30

EPMD

Top 50 easily

no questions asked kinda like Gangstarr a no-brainer

and for those who are not sure or don't know their complete history here's some help with that

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EPMD

top 50 all the way

Top 50.

Without a doubt, they are top 50. One of the greatest groups of all time. They are probably a top 5 group to me, and they have released a top 10 album of all time too.

Top 50

To whom it may concern you know I have to bring up old crap but it's funny that Snoop got knocked out the top 50 due to his "lack of lyrical ability" but yet two average lyrical rappers make top 50?? I love EPMD but even I know they are not lyricist especially Erik, Parish had his time with the dope lyrics. What's up with that?

Consistency Kev! Consistency! I think it's safe to assume that EPMD's 1st 4 albums are 4.5 stars or better to most people. Not to mention EPMD's albums have always been better produced, and this is coming from someone who voted for Snoop to be top 100 at least.

Man folks always try to pull that inconsistant stuff with Snoop but imo he only has one maybe two inconsistant albums. And let's not even bring up production because Snoop keeps bangers most of the time no matter who supplies it.

KRob86 wrote:

Man folks always try to pull that inconsistant stuff with Snoop but imo he only has one maybe two inconsistant albums. And let's not even bring up production because Snoop keeps bangers most of the time no matter who supplies it.

I wasn't saying i thought he was inconsistent. Although he's had a few mishaps along the way. IMO, consistency means more than just going up in down. I mean Snoop would put out a 5 star album, then a 4, then a 3.5, and then he was back up to 4.5. EPMD were consistenly at 4.5 stars. Do you really think Snoop's production rivaled EPMD's?

Top 50 for me.

While they were not mind blowing rhymers as Kev pointed out, they sure created a unique sound in the boom of the east coast golden age. And I feel the production value and spawned success with the production styles here warrants more than enough attention for a top spot. But really, the discog holds its own without solo works. The first 3 are classics to me, and they don't fall below 4 stars until "We Mean Business" IMO.

T. Myers wrote:

KRob86 wrote:

Man folks always try to pull that inconsistant stuff with Snoop but imo he only has one maybe two inconsistant albums. And let's not even bring up production because Snoop keeps bangers most of the time no matter who supplies it.

I wasn't saying i thought he was inconsistent. Although he's had a few mishaps along the way. IMO, consistency means more than just going up in down. I mean Snoop would put out a 5 star album, then a 4, then a 3.5, and then he was back up to 4.5. EPMD were consistenly at 4.5 stars. Do you really think Snoop's production rivaled EPMD's?

Yes I do especially on Doggystyle, Last Meal, Paid The Cost, and Blue Carpet Treatment. I am not trying to argue EPMD's worth of top 50 but i'm just showing the one sided views that seem to come with certain artist. EPMD to me have more classic singles than albums as with Snoop so they both should be top 50. EPMD has some mishaps also just like almost any artist.

KRob86 wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

KRob86 wrote:

Man folks always try to pull that inconsistant stuff with Snoop but imo he only has one maybe two inconsistant albums. And let's not even bring up production because Snoop keeps bangers most of the time no matter who supplies it.

I wasn't saying i thought he was inconsistent. Although he's had a few mishaps along the way. IMO, consistency means more than just going up in down. I mean Snoop would put out a 5 star album, then a 4, then a 3.5, and then he was back up to 4.5. EPMD were consistenly at 4.5 stars. Do you really think Snoop's production rivaled EPMD's?

Yes I do especially on Doggystyle, Last Meal, Paid The Cost, and Blue Carpet Treatment. I am not trying to argue EPMD's worth of top 50 but i'm just showing the one sided views that seem to come with certain artist. EPMD to me have more classic singles than albums as with Snoop so they both should be top 50. EPMD has some mishaps also just like almost any artist.

With the exception of Doggystyle, I can't really see Snoop's production being better and more cohesive, but that is just a matter of opinion. I would still feel comfortable putting the production on Strictly Business up against Doggystyle though. I'm not saying it's better, but it's close.

KRob86 wrote:

EPMD has some mishaps also just like almost any artist.

True, but those mishaps didn't come until LATE in EPMD's career. I think EPMD should maybe get more props than Snoop because the consistency of their first 4 albums hits so hard during the golden age. Snoop's best records are spread out over time. And I think he may have missed the bus a little bit since he never could match the quality of "Doggystyle". Especially early in his career.

Top 20 for me. Can't front on E's production which basically made the group what it was. PMD was no slouch on them mic, but some boring flows going. It's a trend in the top 50 - Gangstarr, Pete Rock and CL, - great producer makes what would be an boring emcee sound good.

I'm with kev on the snoop thing since I think EPMD has been super garbage since like 1996 but it's all whatever in the shower to me.

A lot of artists are a shell of their former self though. It's just what happens for the most part. For every Scarface, there are 5 Too Shorts.

Scarface is a shell too...meaning that although he has been releasing quality material he's slipped too IMO

he's not as good as he once was...it's called getting older guys and it's going to happen to everybody that chooses to stay alive...lol

EPMD are one of the ten greatest hip-hop groups of all-time to ever do it...

Out of all the older rappers I think Face has done a good job of not being a shell. You want to see shells... look at...

'Face is a shell too SRP, you just don't agree with anything I say and always want to play devil's advocate...lol

'Face today doesn't sound anywhere near as good as 'Face on Mr.Scarface IMO

he has slipped too...I know he's from Tex-ass and you'll defend him to the limit but he has slipped too...he hasn't slipped as bad as say Ice Cube or Cool J but he's slipped too man

well considering he hit is best work on The Fix and his last two CDs are solid as ever I don't think he's slipped at all.

In fact I would say he's held up better than any of the old school rappers people mention...

that's because he's from TEX-ASS

I understand SRP

I already said he didn't slip as much as the others....but IMO he's slipped too

and The Fix is NOT 'Face's best work...Mr.Scarface is..even Kev would say that

You can throw your corny jabs at my home state all you want Powell...

I don't think Face has slipped, he's just in a different place in a different industry. Lyrically he still has it. He's adapted way better than KRS, Rakim, or anyone in the juice crew save for Masta Ace.

He ain't as good SRP aka The Devil aka The Devil's Advocate

He ain't as good as who? 100,000 fans last year said he was better. I'd like to see the teacha and the masta sell that many in 2009...

Powell, do you not think The Fix is a classic?

I like The Fix, Terry I just said it was not 'Face's best effort

I feel his solo debut was that Mr.Scarface


SRP why are you throwing sales stats at me??? because then that means Lil Wayne is the best right now followed by T-Pain, Bow Wow,and AKon

No Powell, you can separate the platinum stars from the underground and vets who have loyal fans who support them when they make quality music - which is Face's case - which is a sign he is far from a shell. Now Kris and Rakim - they only have those fans stuck in the 80s that will support them not matter how average or wack their CDs may be...

I'm not comparing 'Face to anyone else but himself SRP

he set the bar extremely high for himself back in the dayz...he was one of the few out of the south even getting respect in NYC.....he was/still is loved and respected as the Godfather of the south

but in 2009 he has slipped some to what he once was...a shell of himself maybe too strong of wording..how about he just ain't as good as he once was?? any person who has heard 'Face from the late 80's up to now can see that except you probably because you just started listening to him with The Fix right?? I mean I doubt you heard Mr.Scarface when it dropped!

Kris has released alot of quality music SRP but your not feeling him in anyway so telling you that is like talking to a dog on the sidewalk

I'll never listen to any of your opinions about Kris my dude trust me there

Once again Powell, feel free to throw as many inaccurate assumptions my way - they don't bother me.

I see Face growing from his early material through The Fix and he's continued that growth in his last two CDs IMO. This isn't Mr. Scarface anymore we hear - it's a much more mature person and it is reflected on the mic. He has changed, but I would say for the better. And lyrically he is just as sharp so I see no regression you seem to be alluding to.

You're the blind one if you can seriously sit there and say ANYTHING Kris has dropped this decade even comes close to touching his best work. The difference for Kris is night and day when you look at his albums. Now that is a shell of a man if I ever saw one.

D.Powell wrote:

I like The Fix, Terry I just said it was not 'Face's best effort

I feel his solo debut was that Mr.Scarface

I agree that his best material is his older material, but if an artist is still releasing material at 4.5-5.0 stars, than i don't think they have fell off.

his newest one is not 4.5 stars Terry, at least IMO

I've got it at 3.75

I'm not saying he fell off I'm saying he's not as good as he once was and nobody on this forum is going to change my mind about that

this is how I feel about 'Face

he is still respected by me and is still a legend but he has slipped IMO

there is no debate about my opinion, just like there is no debate about yours either

I would say newer work by KRS & Scarface are comparable. While I have a favorite, both are still dropping quality albums. While KRS-One's production value has decreased, his flow and lyrical content remain sharp. I wouldn't say his skills on the mic have faded at all. And if they have, it's very slight.

D.Powell wrote:

his newest one is not 4.5 stars Terry, at least IMO

I've got it at 3.75

I'm not saying he fell off I'm saying he's not as good as he once was and nobody on this forum is going to change my mind about that

this is how I feel about 'Face

he is still respected by me and is still a legend but he has slipped IMO

there is no debate about my opinion, just like there is no debate about yours either

I don't think Emeritus is 4.5 stars either(it's a 4 star album personally). The Fix, Last of a Dying Breed, and MADE are though. you're right though. An opinion can never be wrong.

Minnesota Hip-Hop Fiend wrote:

I would say newer work by KRS & Scarface are comparable. While I have a favorite, both are still dropping quality albums. While KRS-One's production value has decreased, his flow and lyrical content remain sharp. I wouldn't say his skills on the mic have faded at all. And if they have, it's very slight.

The quality of KRS's albums have suffered, but he has not lost "it" lyrically. I'm one of the few who loved Hip Hop Lives though.

Like I said earlier SRP I WILL NEVER LISTEN TO ANY OPINION THAT YOU HAVE OF KRS-ONE

so anything that you say about Kris goes in one ear and right on the floor

I co-sign what you said Pounds...Kris has slipped but he's still very effective just like 'Face

T. Myers wrote:

Minnesota Hip-Hop Fiend wrote:

I would say newer work by KRS & Scarface are comparable. While I have a favorite, both are still dropping quality albums. While KRS-One's production value has decreased, his flow and lyrical content remain sharp. I wouldn't say his skills on the mic have faded at all. And if they have, it's very slight.

The quality of KRS's albums have suffered, but he has not lost "it" lyrically. I'm one of the few who loved Hip Hop Lives though.

I like that one quite a bit too. I think KRS still releases 4-star albums. His last 3 have been 4 stars IMO. The production is always my biggest gripe. I'm generally very happy with KRS' hunger and lyricism though.

Minnesota Hip-Hop Fiend wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

Minnesota Hip-Hop Fiend wrote:

I would say newer work by KRS & Scarface are comparable. While I have a favorite, both are still dropping quality albums. While KRS-One's production value has decreased, his flow and lyrical content remain sharp. I wouldn't say his skills on the mic have faded at all. And if they have, it's very slight.

The quality of KRS's albums have suffered, but he has not lost "it" lyrically. I'm one of the few who loved Hip Hop Lives though.

I like that one quite a bit too. I think KRS still releases 4-star albums. His last 3 have been 4 stars IMO. The production is always my biggest gripe. I'm generally very happy with KRS' hunger and lyricism though.

I meant i really liked it. It's at least 4.5 stars to me. If it was anyone but KRS, the album would be pretentious, but he pulled it off well.

Hip-Hop Lives is one of the few KRS albums I liked lately... but he's made the same album for the last 20 years... Face has grown and expanded with his topic matter - the two are incomparable at this point in their career.

T. Myers wrote:

Minnesota Hip-Hop Fiend wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

Minnesota Hip-Hop Fiend wrote:

I would say newer work by KRS & Scarface are comparable. While I have a favorite, both are still dropping quality albums. While KRS-One's production value has decreased, his flow and lyrical content remain sharp. I wouldn't say his skills on the mic have faded at all. And if they have, it's very slight.

The quality of KRS's albums have suffered, but he has not lost "it" lyrically. I'm one of the few who loved Hip Hop Lives though.

I like that one quite a bit too. I think KRS still releases 4-star albums. His last 3 have been 4 stars IMO. The production is always my biggest gripe. I'm generally very happy with KRS' hunger and lyricism though.

I meant i really liked it. It's at least 4.5 stars to me. If it was anyone but KRS, the album would be pretentious, but he pulled it off well.

I liked it a ton when I got it and may have given it 4.5 then. But it has since worn on me. I still think it's a solid 4 though. I know lots of cats were bitching about the production, but I thought Marl's work was nice. LOL - I here you on the pretentious comment....few, if any rappers can rap them kind of braggadocious lyrics and get away with it without (much) criticism.

I'm surprised everyone on here loved the Fix so much - I thought Face was trying to go more mainstream and I definitely have it on the bottom 1/3 of his records.

Steve wrote:

I'm surprised everyone on here loved the Fix so much - I thought Face was trying to go more mainstream and I definitely have it on the bottom 1/3 of his records.

I personally think it is overrated, but it is widely considered a classic. I think he has at least 3 albums that are better.

T. Myers wrote:

Steve wrote:

I'm surprised everyone on here loved the Fix so much - I thought Face was trying to go more mainstream and I definitely have it on the bottom 1/3 of his records.

I personally think it is overrated, but it is widely considered a classic. I think he has at least 3 albums that are better.

You'd give "Made" 4.5 stars though? I gotta play that one again.

RoyceJustShootsNines wrote:

Hip-Hop Lives is one of the few KRS albums I liked lately... but he's made the same album for the last 20 years... Face has grown and expanded with his topic matter - the two are incomparable at this point in their career.

Nice exchange of ideas Pounds and Terry

but above me you see the words of a Kris hater showing their ugly face

the Kris hater says the absolutely asinine comment that Kris has made the same album for 20 years and the only thing "new" from Kris that this hater has heard was Hip-Hop Lives....LMAO

I tell all forum members this right up front....if your new to this and are not exactly sure about SRP's viewpoints on hip-hop then let me inform you...DO NOT EVER LISTEN TO HIS VIEWS ON KRS-ONE

do not let him influence you....listen to Kris first and then make your decision

I love The Fix. My favorite Face CD because it is more mature than anything else he had done to that point IMO. I slept on it thinking it was going to be commercial but once I got it I was hooked.

I love it like Pounds loves Big Jess...

RoyceJustShootsNines wrote:

I love it like Pounds loves Big Jess...

That's a lot of love!

Minnesota Hip-Hop Fiend wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

Steve wrote:

I'm surprised everyone on here loved the Fix so much - I thought Face was trying to go more mainstream and I definitely have it on the bottom 1/3 of his records.

I personally think it is overrated, but it is widely considered a classic. I think he has at least 3 albums that are better.

You'd give "Made" 4.5 stars though? I gotta play that one again.

Yeah, I really liked MADE. I'm an unabashed Face fan so I may slightly overrate it.

Face imo has done better than KRS album wise in his older age but take that with my bias of course. Even objectively I feel the sameway, KRS has not changed much since his 2nd BDP album to me but I still love'em. Sometimes you don't have to change just keep it consistant. Powell I do some slippage in Face also but it happens to all old school artist. But Face still makes high quality albums even with the lyrical slip here and there.

EPMD is definitely Top 50. Their first 4 albums are straight bangers (The first 3 consensus classics) and they have MANY classic hits. They've also spawned guys like Redman, Das EFX, and Keith Murray. Top 50 all day!

T. Myers wrote:

Consistency Kev! Consistency! I think it's safe to assume that EPMD's 1st 4 albums are 4.5 stars or better to most people. Not to mention EPMD's albums have always been better produced, and this is coming from someone who voted for Snoop to be top 100 at least.

I completely co-sign this, and me and Terry don't always see eye to eye but on this I agree 100%. Strictly Business and Unfinished Business are classics for sure. Business as Usual IMO is a classic and many others consider it such although it's not quite as good as the first two. Business Never Personal is 4.75 stars and would be a classic if it weren't for "Nobody's Safe Chump".

I actually voted Snoop Top 50 because even though he only has one classic, I've liked his albums save for Doggfather and Ego Trippin, and I give him TONS of props for transcending hip-hop the way he has. That said, EPMD ranks higher than Snoop because they've been consistent throughout their careers and didn't start to fizzle out until their 6th album.

Kevin points out that they weren't great lyricists. To that I say that individually they were average at best, but as a team they sounded GREAT together along with DJ Scratch's production.