Album Of The 90's Day 5

MNM's stays on top so far....that must be a REAL classic. Can these two take it down or will they be stepped on also?

Doggystyle, but if that was a different Spice 1 album I'd choose that (cough, Amerikkka'z Nightmare, cough). and it's still fuck Tribe.

187 He Wrote is the one for me with DS following second.

Hey Kev, I don't think I've ever given 187 more than a cursory spin...it didn't grab me like Amerikkka'z Nightmare, would you really put 187 above Amerikkka'z?

Shit yeah! I really like AN but I luv 187 He Wrote, AN second half could not keep the top quality going the 1st half did imo.

Honestly I think the beats were dec throughout but there's a slope to it. I'll d/l this sometime soon and give it another try.

AN may actually be Spice's 3rd best. 187 is better than AN IMO. I vote for Doggystyle here though.

Doggystyle

Thanks for clarifying what the other Spice 1 album was you liked better than AN smh.

N3R0 wrote:

Thanks for clarifying what the other Spice 1 album was you liked better than AN smh.

My Bad. I thought it was understood i was talking about his self titled album, and i never said i liked it more. Some do like it more however.

Hmmm. Does he have anything post-Jive worth peeping?

I only own his 6 Jive albums. They're all solid, but they get a bit redundant so i've never looked for anything else from him.

^^^^^^^Not imo (to Jeff, I agree with you Terry).

You know to me AN falls in that same vein as The Diary, WCBS, and In A Major Way where it was there most popualr or mainstream accepted so most quote as they're best.

KRob86 wrote:

^^^^^^^Not imo.

You know to me AN falls in that same vein as The Diary, WCBS, and In A Major Way where it was there most popualr or mainstream accepted so most quote as they're best.

Co-sign the sentiment. AN is still a really dope album though

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

Good point. The Fix may be the taking Diary's place. I just always noticed especially with more loyal east coast sound fans they always say one of those two are his best albums. Not saying they are 100% wrong or anything just shows me they may not be that deep into him.

KRob86 wrote:

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

Good point. The Fix may be the taking Diary's place. I just always noticed especially with more loyal east coast sound fans they always say one of those two are his best albums. Not saying they are 100% wrong or anything just shows me they may not be that deep into him.

co-sign again

I've always referred to The Fix as an organ transplant. sure it works, but it seems foreign. and it took a lot of effort to make it work. It wasn't natural.

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

This coming from the guy who bumps every white rapper that's ever come out, and considers Country Grammar a classic. What's pop about The Fix asshole??

Even Kev, who's the biggest Face fan and gangsta rap fan here, holds The Fix in high regard so eat a dick!

As for my vote....I'm going with Doggystyle. Midnight Marauders and Doggystyle are VERY close on my rankings but Doggystyle edges it out just barely.

KRob86 wrote:

Good point. The Fix may be the taking Diary's place. I just always noticed especially with more loyal east coast sound fans they always say one of those two are his best albums. Not saying they are 100% wrong or anything just shows me they may not be that deep into him.

I love Face. I just loved the production on The Fix the most. My second fav Face album is his debut, Face Is Back.

KJ Styles wrote:

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

This coming from the guy who bumps every white rapper that's ever come out, and considers Country Grammar a classic. What's pop about The Fix asshole??

Even Kev, who's the biggest Face fan and gangsta rap fan here, holds The Fix in high regard so eat a dick!

As for my vote....I'm going with Doggystyle. Midnight Marauders and Doggystyle are VERY close on my rankings but Doggystyle edges it out just barely.

You don't think The Fix is an album with pop overtones?

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

This coming from the guy who bumps every white rapper that's ever come out, and considers Country Grammar a classic. What's pop about The Fix asshole??

Even Kev, who's the biggest Face fan and gangsta rap fan here, holds The Fix in high regard so eat a dick!

As for my vote....I'm going with Doggystyle. Midnight Marauders and Doggystyle are VERY close on my rankings but Doggystyle edges it out just barely.

You don't think The Fix is an album with pop overtones?

Nope. Why is it that when an album features 1 or 2 R&B singers that it's considered pop? And the songs that do have those singers (In Between Us, Someday, and Heaven) really can't be considered pop due to the subject matter of them.

KJ Styles wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

This coming from the guy who bumps every white rapper that's ever come out, and considers Country Grammar a classic. What's pop about The Fix asshole??

Even Kev, who's the biggest Face fan and gangsta rap fan here, holds The Fix in high regard so eat a dick!

As for my vote....I'm going with Doggystyle. Midnight Marauders and Doggystyle are VERY close on my rankings but Doggystyle edges it out just barely.

You don't think The Fix is an album with pop overtones?

Nope. Why is it that when an album features 1 or 2 R&B singers that it's considered pop? And the songs that do have those singers (In Between Us, Someday, and Heaven) really can't be considered pop due to the subject matter of them.

Well, it's more than just that. You also got appearances by other acts who've been more pop than Face, and there are at least 4 Kanye beats and a Neptunes beat. They're not exactly Mike Dean or NO Joe.

KJ, don't be so goddamn sensitive. If Tech N9ne came out with an album of straight forward east coast leaning hip hop you might actually dig that too. There's nothing wrong with having taste preferences.


For the record, white rappers I don't care for:

Hot Karl
Beastie Boys
3rd Bass
BeKay
ICP
Twiztid (although they have talent, their beat selection and juggalo leanings are waaaaaaaack)
ABK
Boondox
Vanilla Ice
Killa C
Unknown Prophets
Will Smith

N3R0 wrote:

KJ, don't be so goddamn sensitive. If Tech N9ne came out with an album of straight forward east coast leaning hip hop you might actually dig that too. There's nothing wrong with having taste preferences.

I only went at you because you called me out.

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

This coming from the guy who bumps every white rapper that's ever come out, and considers Country Grammar a classic. What's pop about The Fix asshole??

Even Kev, who's the biggest Face fan and gangsta rap fan here, holds The Fix in high regard so eat a dick!

As for my vote....I'm going with Doggystyle. Midnight Marauders and Doggystyle are VERY close on my rankings but Doggystyle edges it out just barely.

You don't think The Fix is an album with pop overtones?

Nope. Why is it that when an album features 1 or 2 R&B singers that it's considered pop? And the songs that do have those singers (In Between Us, Someday, and Heaven) really can't be considered pop due to the subject matter of them.

Well, it's more than just that. You also got appearances by other acts who've been more pop than Face, and there are at least 4 Kanye beats and a Neptunes beat. They're not exactly Mike Dean or NO Joe.

I see your point, but the title of the album alone (a drug reference) seems pretty far removed from pop. Not to mention the subject matter of the aforementioned songs, as well as On My Block, Guess Who's Back, In Cold Blood, and Hold Me Down.

Also, Mike Dean does do some production on the Fix, albeit not as much as he usually does on Face albums.

KJ Styles wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

This coming from the guy who bumps every white rapper that's ever come out, and considers Country Grammar a classic. What's pop about The Fix asshole??

Even Kev, who's the biggest Face fan and gangsta rap fan here, holds The Fix in high regard so eat a dick!

As for my vote....I'm going with Doggystyle. Midnight Marauders and Doggystyle are VERY close on my rankings but Doggystyle edges it out just barely.

You don't think The Fix is an album with pop overtones?

Nope. Why is it that when an album features 1 or 2 R&B singers that it's considered pop? And the songs that do have those singers (In Between Us, Someday, and Heaven) really can't be considered pop due to the subject matter of them.

Well, it's more than just that. You also got appearances by other acts who've been more pop than Face, and there are at least 4 Kanye beats and a Neptunes beat. They're not exactly Mike Dean or NO Joe.

I see your point, but the title of the album alone (a drug reference) seems pretty far removed from pop. Not to mention the subject matter of the aforementioned songs, as well as On My Block, Guess Who's Back, In Cold Blood, and Hold Me Down.

Also, Mike Dean does do some production on the Fix, albeit not as much as he usually does on Face albums.

Oh, it's definitely not a pop album. It's an undenieble Face album but the inclusion of Kanye, Jay-Z, Beanie Sigel, and The Neptunes make it far more accessible and "pop"ular.

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

T. Myers wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

N3R0 wrote:

I'm a pretty hardcore Scarface fan, and I still think Diary is his best. Last Of A Dying Breed is close, but I've always thought of The Fix as the "pop" choice. IE: KJ likes it.

This coming from the guy who bumps every white rapper that's ever come out, and considers Country Grammar a classic. What's pop about The Fix asshole??

Even Kev, who's the biggest Face fan and gangsta rap fan here, holds The Fix in high regard so eat a dick!

As for my vote....I'm going with Doggystyle. Midnight Marauders and Doggystyle are VERY close on my rankings but Doggystyle edges it out just barely.

You don't think The Fix is an album with pop overtones?

Nope. Why is it that when an album features 1 or 2 R&B singers that it's considered pop? And the songs that do have those singers (In Between Us, Someday, and Heaven) really can't be considered pop due to the subject matter of them.

Well, it's more than just that. You also got appearances by other acts who've been more pop than Face, and there are at least 4 Kanye beats and a Neptunes beat. They're not exactly Mike Dean or NO Joe.

I see your point, but the title of the album alone (a drug reference) seems pretty far removed from pop. Not to mention the subject matter of the aforementioned songs, as well as On My Block, Guess Who's Back, In Cold Blood, and Hold Me Down.

Also, Mike Dean does do some production on the Fix, albeit not as much as he usually does on Face albums.

Oh, it's definitely not a pop album. It's an undenieble Face album but the inclusion of Kanye, Jay-Z, Beanie Sigel, and The Neptunes make it far more accessible and "pop"ular.

Beanie isn't exactly pop, but I see your point.

i can see some pop overtones in the Fix, Face's debut has become my favorite from him tho

Tribe

Tribe for me again

the fix does feel like a more pop sounding album.

tribe for me

tribe

Tribe comes in 3rd here for me. 187 He Wrote is a great album, my favorite from Spice 1, but "Doggystyle" wins fairly easily.

Cory wrote:

the fix does feel like a more pop sounding album.

I seriously don't know what you guys are hearing. The subject matter on The Fix isn't the least bit pop. Even Jay's verse on Guess Who's Back is like a rags to riches story. And Face talks about street life throughout the album.

Just because Kanye and Neptunes are in the liner notes of an LP doesn't necessarily make it pop.

I see what some are saying KJ but they are going to extremes calling the album more pop. I think more accessible fits betta because nothing about Face is even near pop. I think he expanded his sound to a more "hip hop head" type sound but thats it.

KRob86 wrote:

I see what some are saying KJ but they are going to extremes calling the album more pop. I think more accessible fits betta because nothing about Face is even near pop. I think he expanded his sound to a more "hip hop head" type sound but thats it.

Yeah that's more accurate. He worked with a few different producers to branch out to hip-hop fans nationwide, but the album isn't pop by any stretch of the imagination.

KJ Styles wrote:

Cory wrote:

the fix does feel like a more pop sounding album.

I seriously don't know what you guys are hearing. The subject matter on The Fix isn't the least bit pop. Even Jay's verse on Guess Who's Back is like a rags to riches story. And Face talks about street life throughout the album.

Just because Kanye and Neptunes are in the liner notes of an LP doesn't necessarily make it pop.

i listened to the fix today in full and the beats and singing on track juust felt more mainstream then past shit. its still a dope album, but its not like faces past shit

I think The Fix was Face "grown man"/peak of career album like Stillmatic and Blueprint.

KRob86 wrote:

I see what some are saying KJ but they are going to extremes calling the album more pop. I think more accessible fits betta because nothing about Face is even near pop. I think he expanded his sound to a more "hip hop head" type sound but thats it.

That's just semantics Kev. Pop and accessible are interchangable. You don't use The Neptunes and Kanye to expand your sound to more hip hop heads. You would use Pete Rock, Premier, and producers of that ilk.

Kanye beats are not pop by nature the people just made them more popular because of their choice. Ye cannot be tagged pop when his music is just as natural as any rappers it just so happens to have mass appeal. Neptunes make more popish tunes so I can see your argument for them but the beats they gave Face do sound like anything popish they have done for other artist. "Oh No" anyone?

Let's leave it at this. Listen to Face's debut, then listen to The Fix and then ask yourself which is more pop/appealing to the masses. That's what is trying to be said.

Shaun wrote:

Let's leave it at this. Listen to Face's debut, then listen to The Fix and then ask yourself which is more pop/appealing to the masses. That's what is trying to be said.

Neither really....but of course I agree the Fix has more rounded sound but nothing about My Block and Guess Who's Back would make 16 yr old boys and girls rush to buy his album right?

KRob86 wrote:

Shaun wrote:

Let's leave it at this. Listen to Face's debut, then listen to The Fix and then ask yourself which is more pop/appealing to the masses. That's what is trying to be said.

Neither really....but of course I agree the Fix has more rounded sound but nothing about My Block and Guess Who's Back would make 16 yr old boys and girls rush to buy his album right?

Nope, if that were the case he would have done Jay or Outkast numbers.

Comparing Scarface to Jay-Z and Outkast is ludicris. You basically just said that if anybody had their beats and a comparable skill level they'd be multiplatinum, that's ridiculous. The point here is that The Fix, while a dope and honest album, is NOT what hardcore Face fans expect or even necessarily want (even if it's dope, it's still not why I listen to Face) and appealed to a different crowd and therefore is considered "poppier". If you don't get that, you're either being stubborn or ignorant.

N3R0 wrote:

Comparing Scarface to Jay-Z and Outkast is ludicris. You basically just said that if anybody had their beats and a comparable skill level they'd be multiplatinum, that's ridiculous. The point here is that The Fix, while a dope and honest album, is NOT what hardcore Face fans expect or even necessarily want (even if it's dope, it's still not why I listen to Face) and appealed to a different crowd and therefore is considered "poppier". If you don't get that, you're either being stubborn or ignorant.

You're wrong as usual.

Face has even said himself that he wanted to appeal to East Coast fans with The Fix. That's why he featured Jay Z, Nas, and Beanie Sigel on his album, and why he had Kanye and Neptunes do some beats for him. Same thing Ice Cube wanted to do with Amerikkka's Most Wanted when he featured PE on the album and had the Bomb Squad make beats. The goal of both men on said albums was to appeal to a wider fanbase WITHOUT straying away or abandoning their core fanbase, and they succeeded.

What makes an album "pop" isn't the MC's or producers involved (even if they have a history of making "pop" music) it's the subject matter in which someone rhymes. Face's subject matter remained the same as his other LP's. Hence, it's not "poppier". The title of the album is a drug reference for crying out loud! I can't think of any "pop" like album with a theme like that.

What I meant by the Jay and Outkast comparisons are that Jay and Kast appeal to both hardcore and commercial fans because they make both radio friendly music for the casual crowd and deep, mind stimulating music for the hardcore/diehard hip hop fans. Face has rarely made radio friendly music save for "Girl You Know" and a select few other joints.

Wow, that was the most retarded thing I've ever read.

Subject matter has NOTHING to do with "pop". Wow.

It has EVERYTHING to do with the music.

You, sir...I can't even begin to respond with the things that are wrong with that post. Jesus. I'll try to be succint.

Beatles, Bob Dylan, Johnny Cash, etc etc etc ALL talked about sex AND drugs and were "pop".

You REALLY think that if MF Doom was rapping about being in the club in his typical manner over his typical style of beats he'd be "Pop"?

APPEALING TO A DIFFERENT AUDIENCE IS GENERALLY REFERRED TO AS SELLING OUT, BUT PEOPLE WILL GIVE YOU THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT IF THE END PRODUCT IS GOOD, AS WITH THE FIX, SO THEY GENERALLY DENEGRATE THAT CRITICISM INTO SOMETHING ALONG THE LINES OF "IT'S HIS POPPIEST ALBUM". End discussion.

N3R0 wrote:

Wow, that was the most retarded thing I've ever read.

Cuz you're fucking stupid. There's no other explanation for you not understanding. End discussion.

Exactly, because you have no retort for what I just said because you're wrong.

KJ Styles wrote:

KRob86 wrote:

Shaun wrote:

Let's leave it at this. Listen to Face's debut, then listen to The Fix and then ask yourself which is more pop/appealing to the masses. That's what is trying to be said.

Neither really....but of course I agree the Fix has more rounded sound but nothing about My Block and Guess Who's Back would make 16 yr old boys and girls rush to buy his album right?

Nope, if that were the case he would have done Jay or Outkast numbers.

haha thats funny because thats how i got the album. My best friend at the time played My Block one day when we were about 15. i went out got that album the next day and i know that everyone else picked it up because of the track as well. i was in a mad rush to get it

but i got to agree with nero, a lot of pop albums that came out had tough subject matter, but the sound was directed for mainstream appeal