Subject: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 9:31 am
"Oh Biggie didn't copy anybody" "Oh that's all bullshit"
Do the knowledge fellas, do the knowledge.
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 9:47 am
umm I've heard this one before Steven back in 1996, what does this mean?? that Pac is upset?? RIP to the legend baby bubba but this interview is another one of Pac's rants and he had a whole bunch of 'em before he passed my dude...if there was one thing that Pac loved to do it was RANT...he ranted on Bad Boy..he ranted on Dr.Dre...he ranted on Mobb Deep...he ranted on The Fugees....he ranted on Thug Life...he ranted on Da Brat....he ranted on EVERYBODY!
Pac was known as an upset at the world kinda dude who was extremely emotional...kinda like you Steven....I think this is one of the reasons your so obsessed with everything he RANTS about...but thanks for the remembrance of one of Pac's classic interviews..you know what I'm about to post some more of Pac's greatest rants now:
Like I said RIP to the LEGEND..he was brilliant and he is a LEGEND...but he was human and some of these rants should show that....but I know that's your dude Steven..I hear ya dawg....
Last edited by D.Powell on Fri 18 Sep 2009, 9:53 am; edited 1 time in total
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 9:51 am
You disagree that Biggie completely changed his style and started rappin' like Pac after they got together? All the shit that Pac says is true in the interviews you posted
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 9:55 am
Steve wrote:
You disagree that Biggie completely changed his style and started rappin' like Pac after they got together? All the shit that Pac says is true in the interviews you posted
All that shit that Pac said in the interviews I posted was what he FELT...not necessarily true Steven but what he FELT...and that's okay that he felt that way...some others felt another way...who cares man this shit is OLD Steven get over it man...the beef no longer exists because the main heads involved in it are no longer alive man....WHO CARES anymore?? it's all about legacy and the music they left behind now....
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:00 am
How you gonna claim some peace here when you and KJ always be like "Pac was on steroids, All Eyez on Me is wack, etc."? Must be the Nas in you.
You also said Biggie didn't bite Pac's style. I'm asking you point blank did Biggie not evolve into the East Coast (fat) Pac after they got together?
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:19 am
Steve wrote:
How you gonna claim some peace here when you and KJ always be like "Pac was on steroids, All Eyez on Me is wack, etc."? Must be the Nas in you.
You also said Biggie didn't bite Pac's style. I'm asking you point blank did Biggie not evolve into the East Coast (fat) Pac after they got together?
What I said was that All Eyez On Me is like Tupac on steriods and I stand behind that comment because that was the first project he did with Suge and before that project Pac wasn't on it like he was on that project...he was on steriods on that project dealing with the fat devil who had him all gassed the fuck up....real talk...you see Steven I saw Pac chillin in the crowd at the Palladium in '94 and dude was mad humble and pretty fuckin quiet during the more than one hour I saw him chilling in there...talking to some chicks and keeping a mad low profile....the Deathrow version of Pac wasn't like that...that dude was on mental steriods because the fat light skinned devil was all in his ears...
Biggie didn't bite Pac's style in anyway, shape or form...Pac gave Biggie some advice on how to be a chart topping emcee..don't keep everything so hardcore, make some shit for the ladies, so Biggie took that advice and made Big Poppa, Fucking You Tonight, Juicy, and many other examples...he took his advice he didn't bite his style man...get shit straight man, and stop bringing up shit that you have absolutely no idea what the fuck your talking about except for some old ass Pac interviews...LOL...
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:22 am
Word, apparently you are the only authority on that, it was strictly Biggie taking some advice from Pac and not copying him at all. Got ya.
And apparently you haven't seen any of his earlier DU interviews, or videos. Plus, homeboy was at a show, you want him to go buckwild and kanye the dude on stage?
Anyway, you clownin' All Eyez on Me like that is laughable, and Puffy is the real devil my friend.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:24 am
So Biggie and Diddy - two fake dudes who never did shit in the streets - coming together and creating this fake gangster persona is them on steroids too? Under your standards right?
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:25 am
Steve your starting to really believe your the internet Tupac man...slow down my dude real talk....nobody gets all emotional over this Pac shit anymore man...it's over and been that way since 1996...
I will always defend Biggie on the mic as far as his lyrical skills...I will always defend his albums and input to hip-hop culture but as far as who he was fucking..or how good of a father he was..or how much of a punk he really was or wasn't...or how much beef he had..that shit is irrelevant to me man...that was his business and his issues or non issues and he hasn't been around since 1997 to deal with any of it anyway...so who am I to take up his life???
that's his family's job if they want to do it....
Last edited by D.Powell on Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:28 am; edited 1 time in total
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:27 am
The Real Real Jeru wrote:
So Biggie and Diddy - two fake dudes who never did shit in the streets - coming together and creating this fake gangster persona is them on steroids too? Under your standards right?
RIGHT...your right SRP...yep I agree man!
All Biggie did was sell drugs and make minimal money in the streets...and Diddy was a fuckin nerd man...no doubt about it!
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:28 am
LOL @ internet 2Pac, I might just take that as my internet job.
And dude, the beef was him, because he put it in his records. And you can say now you ignore it, but you clown a bunny like Kanye for shit he does not on record? And word up to what SRP says, that's some mad double standard shit, and apparently shit you judge Pac on too. You mad contradictory dogg.
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:36 am
You see what I wrote up above Steve..I agree with SRP on his comment
Oh and for the record the Palladium was a nightclub on 14th street in NYC not an awards show..it was a nightclub with some of the finest ladies in the city and some pretty expensive drinks...lol....I used to go in there with some of my dudes and toss a few back and peep out the celebs in the house...we saw Prince with his security detail up in there once too, as well as Q-Tip, Diamond D, MC Shan, Brooke Shields(lol), Russell Simmons, and a few others I'm forgetting about now
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:38 am
okay, so what do you expect him to be doing man?
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:41 am
And also if you really agreed with him you'd be all up in biggie's ass for life after death (biggie CLEARLY on steroids and biting pac to the fullest)
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:50 am
2Pac's Ghost wrote:
okay, so what do you expect him to be doing man?
I didn't expect him to be doing shit...but the after Deathrow Pac would've probably been in there on his mental steriod kick and that wasn't really how Pac was at all according to those that really knew him...I told you he went to a performing arts HS in B-More with Jada Pinkett.....he learned how to be a great actor man...Suge had him gassed like a chick, how funny is it now that Suge has lost everything that his fat ass didn't even work for to begin with...he's no entrepreneur, that dude is a fake and the devil....and it's come back to bite his ass
Anyway you think Biggie bit off of Pac's style and I say your 100% wrong, he took his advice and that was it...they sound nothing alike..one is a revolutionary and the other was about party and bullshit...one is more lyrical and the other more emotional....I don't see it baby bubba...sorry man!
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 3:49 pm
2Pac's Ghost wrote:
Word, apparently you are the only authority on that, it was strictly Biggie taking some advice from Pac and not copying him at all. Got ya.
And apparently you haven't seen any of his earlier DU interviews, or videos. Plus, homeboy was at a show, you want him to go buckwild and kanye the dude on stage?
Anyway, you clownin' All Eyez on Me like that is laughable, and Puffy is the real devil my friend.
I never said AEOM was wack, I just said that it's overrated and not the classic that it's made out to be. Nobody felt that it was classic until after Pac passed away whereas Pac's Me Against The World and Biggie's Ready To Die was instantly hailed as classics.
Say what you will about Diddy, but UNLIKE Suge "Booger" Knight he's still in business while that Uncle Phil lookalike went bankrupt because nobody wanted to fuck with him after Snoop left Death Row.
Powell is correct, Biggie didn't bite shit off of Pac. In fact, Pac was cool with Biggie until he FALSELY ACCUSED Biggie of setting him up to get shot. Then that's when Pac started talkin shit and hooked up with Suge.
It's crazy how you and Clancey shit on Biggie and Diddy, yet defend Suge. If it weren't for him, both men would still be alive today. It was Suge's bitch ass that started the whole East Coast/West Coast beef to begin with. Dre wanted nothing to do with it, that's why he left Death Row.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 3:59 pm
LMAO! You are fucking STUPID! Sorry bro, but it was INSTANTLY classic by EVERYONE. You are just a HATER plain and simple; and Ready to Die is the one that WASN'T classic.
No one defends Suge, and Puffy is the main "bad boy" in this case. Dre got run off Death Row for never being in the studio dude, but whatever. There is no point discussing any of this with you because you have your giant NYC goggles on and can see nothing else.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 4:08 pm
2Pac's Ghost wrote:
LMAO! You are fucking STUPID! Sorry bro, but it was INSTANTLY classic by EVERYONE. You are just a HATER plain and simple; and Ready to Die is the one that WASN'T classic.
No one defends Suge, and Puffy is the main "bad boy" in this case. Dre got run off Death Row for never being in the studio dude, but whatever. There is no point discussing any of this with you because you have your giant NYC goggles on and can see nothing else.
You're the one that's fucking STUPID and a Pac fanboy, hence the SN. I don't hate Pac at all, in fact he's among my Top 10 of all time. But all that talk about Biggie biting him is bullshit. Their styles weren't much alike at all besides spittin about personal experiences. Pac was mostly political and had deep subject matter (pre AEOM) and Biggie combined hardcore and commercial. Pac didn't start bitchin until he thought Biggie set him up to be shot, which was false.
RTD WAS instantly hailed as a CLASSIC as many consider it the album that brought control of hip-hop back to the East Coast, but you and Clancey are Biggie haters so I'm done talking about it as well.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 4:16 pm
KJ Styles wrote:
2Pac's Ghost wrote:
LMAO! You are fucking STUPID! Sorry bro, but it was INSTANTLY classic by EVERYONE. You are just a HATER plain and simple; and Ready to Die is the one that WASN'T classic.
No one defends Suge, and Puffy is the main "bad boy" in this case. Dre got run off Death Row for never being in the studio dude, but whatever. There is no point discussing any of this with you because you have your giant NYC goggles on and can see nothing else.
You're the one that's fucking STUPID and a Pac fanboy, hence the SN. I don't hate Pac at all, in fact he's among my Top 10 of all time. But all that talk about Biggie biting him is bullshit. Their styles weren't much alike at all besides spittin about personal experiences. Pac was mostly political and had deep subject matter (pre AEOM) and Biggie combined hardcore and commercial. Pac didn't start bitchin until he thought Biggie set him up to be shot, which was false.
RTD WAS instantly hailed as a CLASSIC as many consider it the album that brought control of hip-hop back to the East Coast, but you and Clancey are Biggie haters so I'm done talking about it as well.
I love Biggie - he is in my top 100. But we already had the discussion of you ignoring Enter the 36 Chambers and Illmatic when convenient for your Biggie splooging.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 4:20 pm
The Real Real Jeru wrote:
I love Biggie - he is in my top 100. But we already had the discussion of you ignoring Enter the 36 Chambers and Illmatic when convenient for your Biggie splooging.
I'm not discounting the impact of Illmatic or 36 Chambers. Illmatic is my all time fav album and 36 Chambers is in my Top 10. But Ready To Die outsold both of them. Which is why it's considered the album that brought control back to the East and as a result, Bad Boy became equally as large as Death Row.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 4:25 pm
It's not hard to outsell illmatic. But Wu-Tang went gold and platinum right along the same pace as Ready to Die. RTD did go on to go double and triple plat over the years... but I think at the time you would be a fool to say Wu had not brought back the east coast.
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 5:00 pm
"I love Biggie - he is in my top 100. But we already had the discussion of you ignoring Enter the 36 Chambers and Illmatic when convenient for your Biggie splooging.[/quote]"
Umm SRP, Biggie is in your top 100?? and you love him???
Did you know that I love Andre Nickatina who is in my top 20,000 and Mac Dre as well who is in my top 15,000?? just showing "love" to two of my favorite emcees baby bubba...
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 5:10 pm
Considering all the emcees I have heard Powell - top 100 is quite an honor for Biggie - and I never said where in my top 100 he sat...
You're missing out on Dre and Dre
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 5:22 pm
Another sign of KJ's stupidity - Pac continued to be deep on All Eyez on Me (have you heard this album) and on out through all his albums. RTD did not bring back the East, The Sun Still Rises, Illmatic, 36 Chambers, etc. did.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 5:34 pm
"Music writer David Drake of Stylus Magazine wrote of hip hop during 1994 and its contributions, stating: The beats were hot, the rhymes were hot - it really was an amazing time for hip-hop and music in general. This was the critical point for the East Coast, a time when rappers from the New York area were releasing bucketloads of thrilling work - Digable Planets, Gang Starr, Pete Rock, Jeru, O.C., Organized Konfusion - I mean, this was a year of serious music.[3] —David Drake Nas's debut album Illmatic has been noted as a high point of the East Coast hip hop scene, and featured production from such renown New York-based producers as Large Professor, Pete Rock and DJ Premier.[3] Gabe Gloden of Stylus Magazine later wrote, "From my perspective in the Midwest, the market was dominated by West Coast hip hop, and these albums didn’t make much of a dent in West Coast sales, but with time, these albums filtered their way into everyone’s collections."[3]"
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 5:37 pm
Well my argument is quite simple.
Biggie did nothing new.
He stole the west coast style of g-funk rap.
That's all he did.
He was an east coast version of what was dominating at the time.
Wu-Tang on the other hand completely changed the game.
The beats, rhymes, metaphors, styles, group, etc. were all new shit that revolutionized the game and brought something quite new to the arena.
They literally brought the attention back to the east coast cause heads from all over the country were peeping them and their new ish.
Not so much with the softer rap coming out of NYC at the time.
Biggie just decided to ride trends IMO with his first CD. It worked, no doubt, but his ability to mimic g-funk is what made him popular.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Fri 18 Sep 2009, 10:34 pm
2Pac's Ghost wrote:
Another sign of KJ's stupidity - Pac continued to be deep on All Eyez on Me (have you heard this album) and on out through all his albums. RTD did not bring back the East, The Sun Still Rises, Illmatic, 36 Chambers, etc. did.
Dude, just SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!!
You're a BIGGIE HATER!! Straight up and down!
You don't want to give Ready To Die it's due because YOU HATE BIGGIE!
You hate him because he shared the spotlight with 2Pac, and is the ONLY guy who did so at the time.
You hate him because he got more shine with RTD than Pac did with 2Pacalyspe Now and Strictly For My Nigs COMBINED.
You hate him because you (just like Pac's paranoid ass) think that Biggie set him up to get shot, and think that Who Shot Ya was written about him when it was not.
As much as I love Illmatic and 36 Chambers, neither of them did the numbers that Ready To Die did.
The Sun Rises To The East, even though I love that album too, DOES NOT belong in the same conversation because it DID NOT go platinum and still hasn't to this day.
And before you and/or your running buddy Clancey come back with some "oh it only sold because he died" bullshit, RTD went double platinum BEFORE his death and sold another 2 million afterwards.
Speaking of Clancey, he's full of shit too. Biggie's music has NEVER been described as G-Funk. He's never been a G-Funk rapper. He just PERFECTED the art of combining hardcore and commercial rap, and nobody has done it better since.
I could give you TONS of articles by critics, magazine writers, etc praising Ready To Die and calling it a classic landmark album, but you two jabronies will just dismiss them and say some stupid shit like "those guys are NY biased".
Bottom line, you're a Biggie hater, so nothing you say about the man holds any merit whatsoever.
T. Myers One Of A Kind
Posts : 10879 Join date : 2009-05-06 Age : 42
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 9:29 am
I think it's a little naive to think RTD didn't play a part in returning NY to prominence on a national level, but as KJ mentioned it doesn't mean it's better than Illmatic or 36 Chambers. So the next question is why did it sell better than the other two? The simple answer is that Biggie had the uncanny ability to balance hardcore and mainstream. While that may be true, you also have to ask yourself why was he able to do that? You can't dismiss the track record of the legendary producers he worked with. You also can't ignore Puffy's track record either. Seriously, outside of Russell Simmons who has been more successful than Puff? IMO, Biggie held up his portion of the partnership(his lyrics, flow, delivery, and storytelling are all top notch), but Puff crafted Biggie in the image he wanted. Puffy marketed Biggie in a way Puff could only do. In a round about way Biggie was a corporate creation. it was only when Biggie was honest and genuine that he would really shine(Juicy), but those tracks seemed to be the exception as opposed to the rule. They were always squeezed in between overblown gangster fairy tales and playboy type bragadoccia. A lot of the time Biggie's tracks rang hollow even though they were well crafted. It seemed to be missing truth and sincerity. I know a lot of other artists have done the same, but it seemed different with Biggie. it seemed over the top. It seemed more Scarface-esque while Kool G Rap seemed more epic and more Godfather-esque.
Truth and sincerity is something that was never questioned when it came to Pac. Was he always right? No! Was he hypocritical? Yes! However, we are all hypocritical. It's impossible to not be. That was the human element that was missing from Biggie most of the time. Pac touched EVERYONE. As far as Powell's claims about Pac being overly gangsta on AEOM, i think there may be some truth to it, but prison has a way of messing with a person's mind especially when the person thinks he was incarcerated unjustly. Pac was angry, and Suge gave him an outlet for that anger. Pac and Suge probably fed off each other, and they worked each other into a frenzy. it wasn't Pac trying to be big and bad, it was an honest culmination of everything Pac went through. It was a glimpse into his psyche at that time. Pac was always honest. sometimes it was to his detriment, but honest nonetheless. I've heard Powell and maybe even KJ say that Pac didn't even have a criminal record until after he became famous, but in the immortal words of Biggie "Mo Money Mo Problems", right?
The decision really comes down to whether or not you want straight lyricism centered around contrived and fictional events, or if you want honest, personal, and emotional hip hop that may not be as technically proficient. I personally don't think you can go wrong with either, but i honestly don't know why anyone outside of NY would prefer Biggie. I'm obviously riding with Pac. Biggie has never created anything as touching as Papaz Song, So Many Tears, Life Goes On, and Dear Mama. There are plenty more, but i think everyone gets the point.
This wasn't meant to be a Biggie bash fest. I tried to be as unbiased as possible, but i'm sure my preference did creep into my opinions. However, i do like Biggie(RTD is 5 stars to me and LAD is around 4.25-4.5). It's just my honest perspective on the two legends.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 10:23 am
I appreciate your objectivity Terry.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 11:07 am
Damn, I own all of Biggie's CDs and I bump them - I guess that makes me hater? Fuck off KJ - you have nothing good to say so you resort to bullshit.
Andre Nickatina - The Ave (1993)
Andre Nickatina - Lips (1993)
Crazy how Biggie's two biggest hits from his first album used the same beat as two of the hits off Dre Dog's album which dropped a year earlier and one of which had a video in rotation. And before you start bitching about some regional shit, his label was nationwide at the time.
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 11:10 am
Biggie has always been a creation, and bitten other dudes styles, and apparently his best beats too. Biggie is good for those who don't know much about rap East of the Mississippi I guess
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 11:41 am
I have not read all the comments but Biggie was a dope lyricists period with ot without Diddy or a hype hachine. Only thing Diddy created was the hype machine and mainstream access for Big and that is what a manager/ceo is supposed to do for thier flagship artists right?
Plus those two AN songs mean nothing who hasn't Juicy and Between The Sheets? Plus Poison Clan had a Check Out The Ave the same year so did Dre Dog bite them?
D.Powell NYC's Finest
Posts : 7631 Join date : 2009-05-11 Age : 103 Location : the back of a barn
Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 11:43 am
All of this who prefers either Biggie or Pac shit is BORING...it's played OUT and Steve your my dude and all but please SHUT THE FUCK UP
Your the obssessed one who keeps making this BORING shit an issue
these two LEGENDS are deceased...they both made an incredible mark on hip-hop culture...they both influenced several emcees, they both made incredible records
who gives a fuck if Steve or anyone else for that matter thinks Biggie bit off of Pac?? who really gives a fuck if I think that Pac was full of mental steriods after he hooked up with Suge?? who cares if Diddy was nerd who morphed into an entertainer??
All of these discussions are useless because the main two priniciples involved are deceased...they are no longer here to add anything more to their legacy so alot of the dumb shit we are talking about is mainly speculation and opinion...for all we know these dudes had they lived out of their 20's would've been making dope tracks together, I mean KRS and Marley Marl have done it so why not them??
let's concentrate on some LIVING artists who are still adding to their claims to fame...nobody's mind is going to change on these deceased artists that's for damn sure..so this thread is STUPID....there I said it!
Last edited by D.Powell on Sat 19 Sep 2009, 11:46 am; edited 1 time in total
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 11:45 am
New Jim Jones came out before Ruff Town behavior Kev, plus the Ave was the single for New Jim Jones and came out well in advance of the album
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Subject: Re: This is for Powell and KJ Sat 19 Sep 2009, 11:52 am
2Pac's Ghost wrote:
New Jim Jones came out before Ruff Town behavior Kev, plus the Ave was the single for New Jim Jones and came out well in advance of the album
Dre Dog only came out 8 days before PC and Check Out The Ave was a single for PC also. They had a video in rotation also.