Drayz of Das Efx (ft. Lil Wayne) - Die Like This

ctrx wrote:

Quote :

Let's see...Coolio pretty much ruined his legacy with all his wack shit he keeps putting out... and he was bigger and has a bigger legacy than Das Efx... Nelly is close to ruining his legacy as the singy songy rapper.... bone have pretty much fucked up their career...Flava flav has done alot to fuck up his legacy and that has included a wack ass CD... so nice try.

You're comparing apples and oranges here. Coolio's legacy? If he had stopped recording in '97 he still would have been remembered for "Gangsta's Paradise," the "Kenan and Kel" theme, and rapping with Kermit on "Muppets Tonight'...essentially, a one-hit-wonder West Coast Fresh Prince with gravity-defying braids who also happened to have a few decent LPs and was in the Maad Circle.

Nelly's legacy is rooted in pop singles and chart success. He's not a rapper who made it big based on his street cred or local acclaim. He was brilliantly produced and brilliantly promoted from "Country Grammar," and from there his marketers attempted to capitalize off what sold, which resulted in country ballads with Tim McGraw.

Bone haven't ruined their legacies any more than Wu-Tang...the most iconic rap acts, or acts of any commercial music genre, make their most iconic music early on. They're a large collective of disparate talents and it would be unreasonable to expect them to truck out an "E. 1999" every two years.

Flavor Flav's reality shows are obviously embarrassing, but what "legacy" do you think he had? Anybody who knew him before only knew him as the buffoon hypeman in Public Enemy. He may have been respected for being down with Chuck D, but he wasn't respected for his skills or intellect.

Quote :

you and pete seem caught up on how popular Das EFX were close to 20 years ago

When "Dead Serious" dropped 20 years ago I was six months old and shitting my pants. I can't speak at all about their influence from popularity's standpoint, but I can speak to their fairly long, fruitful career with multiple strong albums and influence. And while Pedro you are definitely a voice of reason your "you ain't from BK" argument is ridiculous. I don't have to be from fucking Brooklyn to appreciate a rap group's influence and I never said I did.

1. We're going to just have to disagree on Coolio. His first solo went platinum, his second when multiplatinum, and his third went gold. Yes, he had one HUGE hit, but he was way more than a one hit wonder. Das EFX had street cred but a guy who was put on by Dub C and who had emcees like Ras Kass on his albums had no street cred or hip-hop cred? I think that's just you choosing to ignore facts to fit your argument again.

2, Nelly's legacy is for putting St. Louis and the midwest back on the map and introducing a new singy songy rap style to the game. He was considered original for a time and now he just seems to be trying to copy trends.

3. You really think Wu tangs sub par work compares to the utter shit that is Bone solos, Bone Brothers, etc.? I can't help you on that one.

4. I see that just because he was a clown and jokester Flava Flav is allowed to do whatever he wants. That makes no fucking sense. He represented a black power movement with a black power group and he then turns around and promotes ignorance and stereotypes and sells out to a corporation who exploits him. This is against everything PE stood for, but I guess rappers can go against their message as long as they aren't the main members? Or what exactly is the rule here? Because Flava Flav was just an animated, but totally useless hype man goofball. If he hadn't been in PE he probably would have not had even a fraction of the success he has had. People respect him because of his affiliation with PE, but somehow he isn't capable of hurting his legacy.

5. I thought you might miss my point about the Brooklyn thing. It had nothing to do with you or your own experience. I would love to have a discussion on who really ushered in the brooklyn gully sound, but KJ said I couldn't speak to it because I wasn't from Brooklyn. I pointed out the fact that both you and him are not from NYC, yet somehow he felt both of you were qualified to speak on the subject as an example of how ridiculous his argument is. So it was nothing personal, just me pointing out that since none of us are from Brooklyn or knew anyone from that era personally, we all are just as qualified to speak about the music since that is all any of us experienced.

As far as Das EFX, to me they had a 6 year career and really Hold It Down was their last good album. Generation EFX was not very good to me. So their run was from Dead Serious to Hold it Down. If you want to count How We Do you can, but the 5 year break between albums makes it hard to call that part of their career.

Shaun wrote:

Deanie O'Banion wrote:

KJ Styles wrote:

Nelly, most people that were checking for him were kids, women, and white people. Not saying that it doesn't count for anything, but Nelly was never generally considered among the dopest in the game.

It's funny because white people listen to more hip hop than any other race. Because white people are the majority.

Ummm Shaun honey do your homework when you say crazy shit like white people are the "majority, because in actuality Asian people are the MAJORITY....there are more asian people on this planet then any other race.....but there are also more people of COLOR on the planet then there are white folks......this is a FACT...the white people being the "majority" bullshit was sold to us by our founding white forefathers.....in the USA there are more white people then black people yes but I'm referring to globally and that makes complete sense because hip-hop is a global force now and it has been for more than a few years....so it's people of color that started this great music and it's people of color that are listening to it the most on a global scale man.....I just had to clear that up because what you said was kinda offensive my dude...no harm no foul baby bubba......

Talking about hip-hop, not global representation, white people make up the majority of the audience. I mean, Mexicans make up the majority in Mexico, but that hardly has anything to do with anything anybody's discussing here.

As far as comparing Das EFX's exposure to House of Pain or Kriss Kross... the thought is ridiculous. Jump and Jump Around are played at wedding receptions, proms, even still on the radio sometimes... and people actually know who it is they're hearing.

Whether or not the average person would even recognize any song from Das EFX (they would not), they would never guess who it is they're listening to.

parker lewis wrote:

Talking about hip-hop, not global representation, white people make up the majority of the audience. I mean, Mexicans make up the majority in Mexico, but that hardly has anything to do with anything anybody's discussing here.

As far as comparing Das EFX's exposure to House of Pain or Kriss Kross... the thought is ridiculous. Jump and Jump Around are played at wedding receptions, proms, even still on the radio sometimes... and people actually know who it is they're hearing.

Whether or not the average person would even recognize any song from Das EFX (they would not), they would never guess who it is they're listening to.

Again no one was addressing you but you have injected your self into this conversation....obviously everyone around the entire planet is not listening to hip-hop music....but not every white person in the USA is listening to it either right??? so when you say that because white people are supposed to be the so called "majority" then that means that they are the largest segment of the population listening to hip-hop music?? this makes sense to you Parker?? I mean you have shown that you are one stupid motherfucker before but this right here would take the fuckin cake man......please tell me you are not that fuckin dumb man.....PLEASE?????

as far as everyone on here jumping on KJ about this stupid shit about who has a greater legacy Das EFX....Kriss Kross....Coolio.....or House Of Pain who gives a fuck....everyone of those groups are washed up....they are all done as far as creating new and RELEVANT hip-hop music in 2011/2012....


to me legacies are taken into account when we're speaking of those who "transcended" the music....people like Run-D.M.C., LL Cool J, Big Daddy Kane, Rakim, Nas, Ice Cube, KRS-One, Jay-Z, NWA, etc..etc....no one can ever question what these and many others mean to hip-hop including Public Enemy...I don't give a fuck how many flavor of loves that Flav does.....that shit has no impact on PE's hip-hop legacy... .....that sounds dumb man.....stop it!

Alright, so your point on legacy only reinforces the argument against KJ since Das EFX has definitely not transcended music or even hip-hop... unlike House of Pain and Kriss Kross who have cemented themselves within American pop-culture.

As far as your take on demographics, you're making zero sense. Nonsense.

Just because hip-hop is listened to around the world does not make hip-hop's fanbase a microcosm of the global population. As usual you take great liberty with fact and logic, neither of which exist in your claim.

parker lewis wrote:

Alright, so your point on legacy only reinforces the argument against KJ since Das EFX has definitely not transcended music or even hip-hop... unlike House of Pain and Kriss Kross who have cemented themselves within American pop-culture.

As far as your take on demographics, you're making zero sense. Nonsense.

Just because hip-hop is listened to around the world does not make hip-hop's fanbase a microcosm of the global population. As usual you take great liberty with fact and logic, neither of which exist in your claim.

Das EFX brought a new style to hip-hop which is something neither Kris Kross or House Of Pain ever did. Kriss Kross today are looked upon as little kid one hit wonders. I don't see how either of them have cemented themselves among pop culture any more than Das EFX has.

Jump and Jump Around may have been bigger hits than They Want EFX, but if you ask most people they're gonna remember Dead Serious moreso than any album from KK or HOP, and Das EFX's career was far more prolific than either of those groups, and that's a fact.

I don't think you understand what prolific means. Das EFX released two more albums than Kris Kross or House of Pain, but neither group could be considered "prolific" and the fact Das EFX released two more albums says nothing about their legacy either way. When active, all three groups released albums at the same steady pace and after 1996 Das EFX's output would be the polar opposite of prolific.

Really... more people remember Das EFX than House of Pain or Kriss Kross? Do you have any respect for reality at all? Do me a favor... next time you go to work, just ask a few people if they remember Jump Around, Jump, and any song from Das EFX. Go ahead, try it.

I definitely already established that KJ has no idea how to use the word 'prolific' a couple months back.

parker lewis wrote:

Alright, so your point on legacy only reinforces the argument against KJ since Das EFX has definitely not transcended music or even hip-hop... unlike House of Pain and Kriss Kross who have cemented themselves within American pop-culture.

As far as your take on demographics, you're making zero sense. Nonsense.

Just because hip-hop is listened to around the world does not make hip-hop's fanbase a microcosm of the global population. As usual you take great liberty with fact and logic, neither of which exist in your claim.

nah what you said makes no sense dipstick...you agreed that white people are the "majority" of the heads listening to hip-hop, which would equate to the "majority" that lives in the USA....but since hip-hop is now a global entity and has been for over 15 years then I'm including EVERYONE that would potentially be listening to hip-hop and if thats the case then it most certainly can't be all white folks because they are not the "majority" of people that exist GLOBALLY......use your medulla oblongata man....this shit is not that hard to piece together dummy.....lol

House Of Pain...Kriss Kross nor Das EFX has a fuckin "legacy" Parker....stop twisting words I say to agree with you leonard.....none of those groups has a "legacy" to speak of.....2 of them are ONE hit wonders (House Of Pain, Kriss Kross), and one of them was a middle of the road group who released a bunch of very good material but did NOT leave a lasting enough impression on hip-hop culture to have a so called "legacy"


does Milli Vanilli have a "legacy"???


how about Snap???


Technotronic???


maybe Rappin' Duke has a "legacy"??


according to your stupid logic leonard I guess they all do.....dipstick! lol

now this group right here has a LEGACY??? (I think) what would you say leonard??



"Alright, so your point on legacy only reinforces the argument against KJ since Das EFX has definitely not transcended music or even hip-hop... unlike House of Pain and Kriss Kross who have cemented themselves within American pop-culture."


they've clearly "cemented" themselves within American Pop-culture right leonard??? what a "legacy" huh dipstick???

I'm not talking about the majority of people who live anywhere. The only way your assessment bears any relevance would be if every person in the world was a hip-hop fan. Is that what you're saying? That, because hip-hop is appreciated globally, every single person on the globe listens to hip-hop? Otherwise your assumption that Asians make up the most hip-hop fans because Asians make up the most people is entirely baseless.

As far as the legacy discussion, maybe you should go back and check your lap dog's posts. Because he's the one so concerned with Das EFX's legacy and so adamant that it trumps those of House of Pain & Kriss Kross.

So we are actually both saying the same thing about that. Fucking idiot.

Powell glad you said something about Shuans comment. I wanted to but was too lazy to get all in it.

KJ I bet just as many people luv that 1st House Of Pain album as Dead Serious. You just have a hard time being objective. It can be debated that HOP single handely saved the white emcee from being a complete joke to the black/latino communtiy during that time when Vanilla Ice almost killed the species...lol.

parker lewis wrote:

I'm not talking about the majority of people who live anywhere. The only way your assessment bears any relevance would be if every person in the world was a hip-hop fan. Is that what you're saying? That, because hip-hop is appreciated globally, every single person on the globe listens to hip-hop? Otherwise your assumption that Asians make up the most hip-hop fans because Asians make up the most people is entirely baseless.

As far as the legacy discussion, maybe you should go back and check your lap dog's posts. Because he's the one so concerned with Das EFX's legacy and so adamant that it trumps those of House of Pain & Kriss Kross.

So we are actually both saying the same thing about that. Fucking idiot.

No stupid what I'm saying is that the "majority" of hip-hop listeners are NOT white folks that is what I'm saying motherfucker......I'm disputing what you and Shaun are saying....got it??? damn your dumb...everytime you try and mess with me you swallow your own dick whole.....aren't you sick of spitting out that twig?? cut it out leonard and stop acting your some damn professor of hip-hop and smarter than everyone that posts on here lil dude....cause your not....

That's fine that you dispute the alleged demographics of hip-hop. It's entirely disputable. I would actually enjoy an intelligent debate on the matter.

Like I said, though, the argument you're making here is complete nonsense.

Context is something Powell is not familiar with.

The majority of hip-hop fans world wide are probably white. At least the ones who purchase it. Do we have any real way of figuring it out? Probably not... but in the two places where rap music sells the most (USA and Europe) the majority of the fans there are white. Not really sure how popular hip-hop can be in certain other countries due to so many different factors.

Southern Rap Pro wrote:

Context is something Powell is not familiar with.

The majority of hip-hop fans world wide are probably white. At least the ones who purchase it. Do we have any real way of figuring it out? Probably not... but in the two places where rap music sells the most (USA and Europe) the majority of the fans there are white. Not really sure how popular hip-hop can be in certain other countries due to so many different factors.

so hip-hop does not sell in africa?? it does not sell in japan?? china?? india??? bahamas??





if you want to take professor dipsticks side then so be it but i'm not falling for the BULLSHIT

I will dispute his and Shaun's and your claim too...cause it's bullshit...plain and simple!!! are you taking this in CONTEXT Pedro?? is it clear enough for ya???

What are the sales numbers for rap albums in Africa? Or China? Or Japan? or India? or the Bahamas? When was the last time a major rap act did a tour of india or china or africa or Japan? Not a few shows, but a whole tour country or continent wide? For Africa, what number of those people have access to clean water, food, and basic needs let alone things like internet, radio, or a record store?

Southern Rap Pro wrote:

What are the sales numbers for rap albums in Africa? Or China? Or Japan? or India? or the Bahamas? When was the last time a major rap act did a tour of india or china or africa or Japan? Not a few shows, but a whole tour country or continent wide? For Africa, what number of those people have access to clean water, food, and basic needs let alone things like internet, radio, or a record store?

Apparently you are only familiar with Africa from We Are The World....Africa has many populated/advanced cities my dudes, and they are not all poor and what does being poor have to do with being a hip-hop fan/listener anyway? it started in the South Bronx (one of the poorest areas in the country) and there are a bunch of hip-hop fans/listeners in that area....get your head out your ass Pedro.....Mexico has a bunch of hip-hop fans/listeners as well.....Cuba too, Domincan Republic too....Reggaton is a spawn of hip-hop baby bubba....people of COLOR reside in those places Pedro...why do you not already know and understand this?? remove your head from your asshole Pedro...it's a beautiful world out there man.....

Nobody's saying that hip-hop doesn't sell globally. We are saying that that fact does not automatically mean that white folk aren't the majority demographic. You saying that it automatically means that whites aren't the majority demographic only further illustrates your delusional understanding of the science of logic.

parker lewis wrote:

Nobody's saying that hip-hop doesn't sell globally. We are saying that that fact does not automatically mean that white folk aren't the majority demographic. You saying that it automatically means that whites aren't the majority demographic only further illustrates your delusional understanding of the science of logic.

I will only answer dumb people like this:

the places I have named are lived in mainly by people of color....being poor is HIP-HOP....being downtrodden is HIP-HOP....being oppressed is HIP-HOP.....people of color equate with those things which is why it was started by us and is mainly followed and listened too by us on a GLOBAL scale....unless your telling me that the heads that live in Vermont, Maine and New Hampshire out number those that live in Africa, China, and Dominican Republic that are hypothetically hip-hop fans??? no one can really completely accurately answer that question which is why I'm basing my belief on what types of people exist, and it is a FACT that white people are NOT the "majority" of people globally.....sorry charlie....

Poverty in Africa is much much much different from poverty in America. And I never said there were not any cities in Africa, but like Parker said, you want to promote your self created myth so you choose to ignore logic.

So, I was right. You are basing your assumption as if every person in the world were a hip-hop fan... or, at the very least you are saying that the population of hip-hop fans is a direct microcosm of the global population.

I say this is a bold assumption and holds no ground when analyzed logically.

Southern Rap Pro wrote:

Poverty in Africa is much much much different from poverty in America. And I never said there were not any cities in Africa, but like Parker said, you want to promote your self created myth so you choose to ignore logic.

I'm ashamed of you man.....REAL TALK!

parker lewis wrote:

So, I was right. You are basing your assumption as if every person in the world were a hip-hop fan... or, at the very least you are saying that the population of hip-hop fans is a direct microcosm of the global population.

I say this is a bold assumption and holds no ground when analyzed logically.

This is what I said right at the very beginning of my conversation....pay attention now:


"Again no one was addressing you but you have injected your self into this conversation....obviously everyone around the entire planet is not listening to hip-hop music....but not every white person in the USA is listening to it either right???"


pay attention next time mmmkay....hey how did you do in school man?? were you an A or D student?? just curious man??

Your statement doesn't rationalize your assumption. It proves there are a considerable amount of variables to the equation. There is no simple answer to this. Believe me, smarter people than you have tried to solve this. Thousands of marketing executives... me...

Going by who actually is buying the majority of music white people are. But on a grand scale who probably listens to it more and stays with it long term its people of color no doubt. For most white fans its a phase they grow out of and they buy into the hype or the fad more so than us also. When that fad wears out I think a lot of them move on to the next hot thing.

parker lewis wrote:

Your statement doesn't rationalize your assumption. It proves there are a considerable amount of variables to the equation. There is no simple answer to this. Believe me, smarter people than you have tried to solve this. Thousands of marketing executives... me...

I am an executive.......an executive of COLOR and proud of that fact as well as a business owner....so I fully believe in my theory.....I'm going on more than just the people purchasing the product...because that doesn't encompass all of the fans/listeners...and since they're are more people of color in the planet than white folks well then that gives me my answer....because once you break down the fact that not all of white people listen/are fans of hip-hop then in lowers the numbers for them even more....not all people of color listen/are fans of hip-hop either but there are greater numbers of us.....so even if it lowers our numbers it's still more than the good ol' white folks.....sorry lil leonard but you lose considerably again......

TicNitty706 wrote:

Going by who actually is buying the majority of music white people are. But on a grand scale who probably listens to it more and stays with it long term its people of color no doubt. For most white fans its a phase they grow out of and they buy into the hype or the fad more so than us also. When that fad wears out I think a lot of them move on to the next hot thing.

Again, assumption... not fact. Not researched anywhere on any level. An imaginary difference between races that you are completely pulling out of your ass. No value whatsoever in an intelligent debate.

Powell, your entire argument is based on a given concerning global race distribution. Would you mind providing your source(s)?

I've been looking around and it seems you are the only person in the world to definitively solve this.

Being such a smart, accomplished, professional individual... I'm sure you understand the difference between true fact and reckless uninformed assumption.

parker lewis wrote:

TicNitty706 wrote:

Going by who actually is buying the majority of music white people are. But on a grand scale who probably listens to it more and stays with it long term its people of color no doubt. For most white fans its a phase they grow out of and they buy into the hype or the fad more so than us also. When that fad wears out I think a lot of them move on to the next hot thing.

Again, assumption... not fact. Not researched anywhere on any level. An imaginary difference between races that you are completely pulling out of your ass. No value whatsoever in an intelligent debate.

"Talking about hip-hop, not global representation, white people make up the majority of the audience. I mean, Mexicans make up the majority in Mexico, but that hardly has anything to do with anything anybody's discussing here."


But this quote right here from "professor" leonard is just FULL of value.....I tell ya! this quote is RICH with "thoughts"......

Looking for your source, Powell.

I'll be the first to admit that I was mislead... there is no evidence, upon research, to prove that white folk make up the majority of hip-hop demographic. Likewise, however, there is zero proof to the contrary.

Now, back to your "facts" about global race distribution... source?

http://www.rapcoalition.org/political_economy_of_music.htm

This article is a little dated Parker, circa 1999, but it seems legit, cites its sources and being from a pro black stance I don't know if that would mean they would be more or less likely to have their facts straight.

That's a pretty great article. The RIAA surveys are suspect, though. A control group of 2900 to determine the racial profile of an entire market demographic? It seems like a waste of time, really.

Looks like I forgot to add 'in the USA' to my post. My bad

parker lewis wrote:

TicNitty706 wrote:

Going by who actually is buying the majority of music white people are. But on a grand scale who probably listens to it more and stays with it long term its people of color no doubt. For most white fans its a phase they grow out of and they buy into the hype or the fad more so than us also. When that fad wears out I think a lot of them move on to the next hot thing.

Again, assumption... not fact. Not researched anywhere on any level. An imaginary difference between races that you are completely pulling out of your ass. No value whatsoever in an intelligent debate.

Says who? You....lol. Look man you already know I know how you do and how you WANT to sound. But the above I stated is closer to fact than your gigantic brain can compute. Most whites are not only hip hop fans they listen to a lot of different music. I'm not saying blacks/latinos do not but i'm almost sure more black and latino's strongly identify with a specific core music. Whites are the mainstream, you guys are the reason one cat is hot one minute and another is hot the next. The whole marketing game plan is to appeal to your buying power for the most part.

Yes... says me.

No way to prove who (which race) buys the most music... no way to prove who listens to what...

You know all about 'most whites', do you? That's interesting...

You're "...almost sure..." about most "...blacks/latinos..."? That sounds very compelling, Kevin.

And let's talk about "Whites are the mainstream..." again, unknowable and immeasurable.

Funny you've got this all figured out while it continue to eludes the Ivy League sociologists who have wandered into marketing research. They have yet to develop a means to effectively measure race in market demographics... they should just call Kevin Robinson...right?

parker lewis wrote:

Yes... says me.

No way to prove who (which race) buys the most music... no way to prove who listens to what...

You know all about 'most whites', do you? That's interesting...

You're "...almost sure..." about most "...blacks/latinos..."? That sounds very compelling, Kevin.

And let's talk about "Whites are the mainstream..." again, unknowable and immeasurable.

Funny you've got this all figured out while it continue to eludes the Ivy League sociologists who have wandered into marketing research. They have yet to develop a means to effectively measure race in market demographics... they should just call Kevin Robinson...right?

'



the census has all the numbers.....go look 'em up leonard....white people are no longer the "majority" even in this country...the increase of hispanic and asian people here has evened up the numbers for people of color and they certainly(white people) are not the "majority" GLOBALLY......

again you keep talking about who buys the music or who goes to the concerts but that doesn't tell the entire story....that doesn't give you all of the hip-hop fans/listeners because that segment of the population is still poor...they may not be able to pay for a concert or buy/download some hip-hop....but it doesn't mean they are any less of a fan than that white boy from Geneva now does it leonard??? prove me wrong lil man?? show me the numbers???

you've been full of shit since your first racist post and you continue to spew that Geneva philosophy in hopes that someone on here thinks your smart.....well Pedro does so you should feel good about that....but I've never been fooled by you leonard.....an "intelligent" debate to you means you have a need due to your insecurity to appear like you've got it all figured out...and not just with this debate but with new hip-hop music...or who the hottest underground emcee is...or politics...or religion....or KJ.....or r&b....or hip-hop production.... hey leonard keep up the good work buddy, some of these heads on here like to buy plastic cows....but me...I like the angus beef my dude....lol

Shaun wrote:

Looks like I forgot to add 'in the USA' to my post. My bad

yes Shaun your bad....because you ain't the "majority" here anymore either.....by 2020 you will be forced to become a part of the "minority" as well....welcome to the club...(I guess)...lol

Who's full of shit, Pile? I'm still waiting for your source on these global statistics you're hedging your theory on. Take your time, buddy... there are none. So, again... who's full of shit? You are. Again.

Also, show where I even once claim that sales = entire fanbase. Again, take your time... I never did that. So, again... who's full of shit? You are. Again.

And you respond to my request for your sources by demanding me to give my sources for the numbers I've been claiming. Well, this really shows how little comprehension skills you have.

I have not claimed to know anything about how many of which race does what. My whole argument has been that your figures are bullshit because there is zero dependable research on global race distribution or race distribution in hip-hop market demographic.

These are statistics you claim to have some concrete knowledge on, and I ask (again): "What are your sources?"

Pile, where do you get your information that white people aren't a global majority? Now, don't take extra steps here. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm asking where you find statistics on global race populations. Short answer... you don't. There aren't any.

So, again... who's full of shit? You are. Again.

Meanwhile you still fail to acknowledge the complete leap of faith you are taking by prescribing a direct microcosmic relationship between total population and population of hip-hop fans.

Total bullshit that would never fly in any sort of debate. Which, like it or not, that's what this is.

"My whole argument has been that your figures are bullshit because there is zero dependable research on global race distribution or race distribution in hip-hop market demographic. "


Aren't you the same penis that agreed with Shaun when he mentioned that white people were the majority when it came to being hip-hop listeners?? that was you right?? or do I have to start quoting again...lol...


Asians are people of color right??? they have always been acknowledged that way were I live....samething with hispanics...samething with blacks....indians....arabs...etc

I have always been taught that anything that is not white is a person of color......this was what the white people wanted even though white is obviously a color as well....they wanted supremacy...they wanted to rule....well globally white people are NOT the majority....this is an easy and very simple fact.....live in denial all you want even though you know I am right.....bullshit ass lil leonard....again the appearance of being intelligent is just that an appearance...lol


I'm done with this discussion.......I dispute you and Shaun's claims that white people makeup the majority of hip-hop fans and listeners....that is all....lol

I already admitted that I had no business stating that white people make up the majority of anything, let alone 'hip-hop listeners'. Reason being is that there has never been developed an effectual means to measure race distribution within that community... or the global community.

This is the same reason you have no business stating your assumptions on the matter as fact. Because they just are not that.

So, if you are going to persist that you know; for a fact; that whites are not a global majority... then please provide one single legitimate, credible source. Just one.

Otherwise recognize that what you are presenting is an assumption... not admissible as a given for logical foundation within any responsible, intelligent debate or discussion.

When you are disagreeing you cannot spout off random beliefs and expect those you are disagreeing with to pretend those beliefs hold water... unless you can provide some sort of legitimate source.

If - by some miracle - you can prove your given of race distribution, then we can discuss the entirely asinine connection you have been trying to establish between global population and the hip-hop fanbase.

Parker you just can't handle the truth we have handed to you on a silver platter. I don't need a bunch of white folks in white coats to tell me some statistics. Just open your eyes and notice the trends. White people do the majority of consumption especially music sales wise. And especially during the 60's up to the early 00's.

1. Consumption is not the debate we're having.

2. An unfounded or unproven statement is a breech in the hull of a winning argument.

3. When we are debating the color of the sky, common observation is sufficient. When we are debating statistics, the corroboration of staticians is required.

4. (3.5?) If you don't respect the research community, don't arm yourself with statistics. If you insist on manufacturing your own statistics based on casual observation, don't expect a debate opponent to honor those 'statistics'.

I may be very frustrating to you right now, but if you bother to internalize any of these guidelines you will benefit when it comes to challenging ideas or having your ideas challenged.

Actually, I already admitted (for a third time, now) that I was wrong to claim that white folks make up the majority of hip-hop's audience.

I'll say again, there is no way to measure racial distribution within a market group.

It's about time for you (pl) to man up and admit that the same lack of information makes your (pl) assertions equally invalid.

2900 is actually a large enough number. If you study sociology and statistics the sample number needed to gain a pretty accurate reflection of the general population is not as big as people think it needs to be as long as your sampling methods are as sound and unbiased as possible.

Yea you're right. I did see quite a bit of criticism on these RIAA surveys, though. And, even you've got to admit that they don't have the greatest reputation. I could see how this information could be bent to influence product development.

But, I'm complaining that nobody sources so I can't really tear down the only one offered.

Anyway, it seems we're all on the same page as far as sales are concerned.